Comments on The Rejectionist: Homework for White Folks

You can tell any kind of story you want as long as...

2010-01-22T09:02:26.279-05:00

You can tell any kind of story you want as long as you end it with "I don't know what that has to do with anything".

Dear Laurel, we totally hear where you are coming ...

2010-01-18T21:29:17.380-05:00

Dear Laurel, we totally hear where you are coming from. But the other side of that argument is that people without power (in this case, people of color) have historically had the ability to tell their stories taken away from them or have had their own histories rewritten. There definitely are people (none of whom are commenting here) who will argue it's never okay for white people to tell stories from the perspective of people of color, and we can certainly see why; we can also see that ultimately, that's a limiting and sometimes impossible position. That said, we would argue that white people need to be really, really careful and really, really respectful when approaching perspectives outside their own experience. In a perfect world, we could all be "just human"--but we're a long ways off from that world. Fingers crossed we will all arrive there soon.

Dear mythicagirl, derail?!? are you kidding? Perhaps if you meant derail upon the train track of AWESOME.

I think you might appreciate this: TIC News: Bloomsbury Seeks Acquistions.

You rock! And I'm jealous. You commented at ...

2010-01-18T12:05:57.829-05:00

You rock!

And I'm jealous. You commented at Ari's.

Keep doin' what you do.

Hi Laurel, My point was a very simple one without...

2010-01-17T22:46:06.446-05:00

Hi Laurel,

My point was a very simple one without jumping further. I'm speaking of this novel specifically, nothing more, not the point of literature, but the point of one book of literature.
In this case, "The Help".

The author of this book chose to speak in the voice of two cultures, and is being widely praised by many for her authenticity.

I'm saying, as a descendent of one of those cultures and of individuals who were domestics from the south, imho, the voice wasn't authentic and I cannot praise it.

Nothing to stop anyone from writing as another culture. I'm only talking about this book.

I've stated a few of my reasons in my original post, but I'll also add;

When creating a black character, the default position, I pray, I hope for writers won't always be a re-creation of past characters seen time and time again. In this case, the bossy loud mouth Minnie and the silent, long suffering Abilene. I've seen Minnie in just about every sitcom with a black maid, which includes the Jeffersons. I've seen Abilene in Imitation of Life with Juanita Hall and Louise Beavers, some would even say she's a version of Mammy from Gone with the Wind. Nurturing, long suffering, not a woman but a writer's idea of black nobility.

The author of THE HELP took liberties in speaking and feeling in what she believes, as black woman, and she has admitted to as much in subsequent interviews.
one such link:
http://www.npr.org/templates/transcript/transcript.php?storyId=120966815

Laurel, many thanks for your response and thoughts on the matter. I wonder, is there a book on the Holocaust in the first person, from both the perspective of a sympathetic Nazi guard and his Jewish concentration camp charge?
I ask this in all sincerity.

And to the blog owners, my apologies, I did not mean to derail the point of this thread.

mythicagirl said: Please understand that since ...

2010-01-16T22:43:06.728-05:00
mythicagirl said: Please understand that since Sackett was born in 1969, I can see why she'd think that all black Southerners spoke that way.

If you take this argument to its infinite conclusion, we've run out of people who can write books from a Holocaust survivor's perspective. Or historicals. Or any other experience that we could not possibly have lived through.

The point of literature is to connect to humanity. Not black, not asian, not native american. Just human. To qualify an author based on their birthdate and race disqualifies the recognition that we can relate, in a real way, to another person's experience. Even if it is not our own.

If we are constitutionally incapable of understanding what someone else might feel or live despite the difference between us, then there is truly no hope for reconciliation.

I argue that white, mainstream, straight, never-had-to-worry-about-it authors who try to bridge the gap to the extent that they write a POV outside of their experience are doing the hardest work there is in crossing the divide. We need to stop terrorizing people from experimenting with a voice that is not native.

This post directed me to great reading all over th...

2010-01-15T16:06:47.682-05:00
This post directed me to great reading all over the place. Thank you! I feel like I just took in a lot. Much appreciated.

"While I see many white readers are extolling...

2010-01-15T16:03:31.141-05:00
"While I see many white readers are extolling the virtue and say the book is spot on, notice it's rare that African American readers and critics and those that experienced the real South from their perspective are raving about the book."

This brings up something else we think is pretty important in this discussion, which is that what is and is not okay for white folks to write about is not really a conversation that white folks should be having; instead it's one we should be listening to. It's easy (and soothing) for us to reassure one another that we have "good intentions," but intentions don't have anything to do with the very real lived experience of racism, which is obviously something white folks will never experience.

It's super exciting to see so many new commenters here; welcome everyone, and thanks so much for participating.

Hi Laura, I for one hated "THE HELP" an...

2010-01-15T13:28:50.146-05:00
Hi Laura,

I for one hated "THE HELP" and I won't go into all the reasons why on this blog, but one that stands out is what you stated, "It's a white woman writing from the p.o.v. of two black women in the 50's/60's, and it's BRILLIANT."

Please understand that since Sackett was born in 1969, I can see why she'd think that all black Southerners spoke that way.

But they didn't. Please note that Martin Luther King was from the South,and during that timeperiod
tradionally Black colleges had heavy enrollment. Unfortunately, when some writers call to mind this timeperiod, they tend to fall back on stereotypes of what they believe African Americans spoke like, and even lived like, which Ms. Sackett has done. Note also, none of the white characters have such heavy southern dialects, yet they all lived in the South.
And please also understand, that I confess, though I may not have been around then either, I have an oral history passed down to me. While I see many white readers are extolling the virtue and say the book is spot on, notice it's rare that African American readers and critics and those that experienced the real South from their perspective are raving about the book.

I also wanted to add this link to your list: http:...

2010-01-15T11:09:09.083-05:00
I also wanted to add this link to your list:
http://blackeyedsusans.blogspot.com/2010/01/mama-lockdown-recognition-for-black.html

There's a great discussion in the comments section that I think definitely needs to be included in this dialogue. At one point, "jl" and myself have an exchange about how writing LGBTQ characters as an ally is similar to writing PoC characters as an ally. Worth checking out what everyone has to say there, as well.

Thank you for this post and for addressing an important issue.

Warm regards,
Neesha

Great post, and links -- thank you.

2010-01-14T22:45:41.753-05:00
Great post, and links -- thank you.

Thanks for the great links, that in turn link to a...

2010-01-14T22:39:08.552-05:00
Thanks for the great links, that in turn link to additional insightful comments on the subject. I'm glad to see people talking about these issues, as it can only raise interest in books by and about people of color. I've edited MultiCultural Review for 16 years now, and over the past couple of years have seen more and more discussion of "the right to write" about cultures besides one's own. One thing that's new in this round of discussion is a greater consciousness of bi-and multi-cultural/racial identity.

Laura: The chick who narrates the audio version o...

2010-01-14T21:03:28.454-05:00
Laura:

The chick who narrates the audio version of The Help is a friend of mine from high school. She came to my post prom party! How cool is that? Octavia Spencer. IMBD her!

I routinely give her static about being my most famous friend. She's been in bunches of movies. I'm my very own version of Almost Famous. It makes me proud that I know her.

I love you.

2010-01-14T20:34:42.096-05:00
I love you.

I doubt that is something I would attempt. Usually...

2010-01-14T20:27:54.992-05:00
I doubt that is something I would attempt. Usually I leave most of the character's description to the reader's imagination, providing more personality than hair color, eyes, and skin color.

ALSO. Have you read The Help? It's a white woman writing from the p.o.v. of two black women in the 50's/60's, and it's BRILLIANT. Amazing. The voice was actually what kept me reading. Difficult to put down.

"sprinkling in non-white characters so you ha...

2010-01-14T18:40:56.455-05:00
"sprinkling in non-white characters so you have some"

Yeah, that's just a repulsive idea. Thanks for clarifying!

Scott: Knowing those guys is research! Thi...

2010-01-14T18:37:31.207-05:00
Scott:

Knowing those guys is research! This is what I was trying to articulate. You know a guy. He happens to be Latino. If you wrote his character it would be him, NOT "the latino guy." Whatever cultural background has influenced him is already present and doesn't have to be explained ad nauseum or accounted for because he is who he is.

This is totally different than sprinkling in non-white characters so you have some. Their entire function is then to be the "not white guy." I would certainly find that insulting. My racial background is now a prop? No, thanks.

"write non-white characters as long as they d...

2010-01-14T17:17:38.317-05:00
"write non-white characters as long as they do research."

This baffles me. I work with a Latino guy named Tony. He likes baseball and home-brewing beer. We talk about work, baseball and beer. And women, too. He likes women. Hell, so do I. Some of my best friends etc. I work with another guy named John. He's Dominican. He likes movies and photography. We talk about work, movies, photography and the part of town we both live in. I know these guys. I could write these guys. I don't think I need to research or vet my writing with anyone. I could write about the Tlingit woman I work with. Or about the Eretrian woman I work with. I would have a harder time writing about the wealthy, white male dean of the college. I don't understand him at all.

*dons devil horns and brandishes picthfork* How i...

2010-01-14T17:14:57.005-05:00
*dons devil horns and brandishes picthfork*

How is it any different than writing cross gender, or about a chef or a psycho or a rabbit?

I'm assuming many writers do these things and don't think twice about it.

I could care less if a red-butted male monkey wrote the next best selling chick lit book. As long as it's good.

ha ha, I just wrote a paper on why I wished more w...

2010-01-14T17:11:15.410-05:00
ha ha, I just wrote a paper on why I wished more white authors would write non-white characters as long as they do research.

Thank you for linking to my interview :) I LOVE ...

2010-01-14T17:02:26.714-05:00
Thank you for linking to my interview :)

I LOVE Chimanda Adichie's video, danger of the single story. She makes some excellent points. I need to read her books. These are some great links and I hadn't seen Nisi Shawl's article yet so thanks for that link.

@Keith-I think (sorry if this is a little addled) that person of color is better than colored person because well... you make a good point actual. For me, it's just easy to abbreviate and it covers the wide range of non-white groups. Colored is more old fashioned and carries with it the sting of segreagation with the 'colored' water fountains, restuarants, etc. However, I wasn't around during that time, so I don't really know why people I don't like colored. I hope that helps a little bit and your question has really got me thinking, I feel a blog post coming on! I'll be checking back to see the comments

2010-01-14T16:55:45.812-05:00
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This is great. I've been struggling with this...

2010-01-14T16:54:54.147-05:00
This is great. I've been struggling with this very topic over the past few days. I want to include some more diverse characters but have been scared off by doing a crappy job of it. I am excited to look through these links. Thank you.

I'm with Ink. As a reader, I'm way more co...

2010-01-14T15:53:18.504-05:00
I'm with Ink. As a reader, I'm way more concerned with the whole person than racial background. It's also the only place most of us stand a chance of "meeting" someone with no preconceived notions based on appearance unless the author chooses to tell us.

I love it when a new character is described in detail and it doesn't become clear until later that they aren't actually of Northern European descent. And I HATE when we get a full description of everyone in the book (green eyes, freckles, skinny, snappy dresser) and the token "other" friend is simply "asian."

Cultural issues that are important to a character's background need to be fleshed out. I shouldn't be expected to make the leap that because the guy is gay that he likes art galleries and shopping.

These links are wonderful :). I've been very ...

2010-01-14T15:48:37.850-05:00
These links are wonderful :). I've been very eager to learn about this subject, as one of those people who wants to be able to write about anyone I want, but doesn't want to "do it wrong."

Great point about doing our homework. Thanks, Le R!